IPM's in uni-8 too easy, propose bashing rule 10 attacks

  • IPM's in uni-8 too easy, propose bashing rule 10 attacks

    REOPENED FOR UNI-10

    Uni-8 is becoming a shooting game atm.

    Asteroids are gone. But players have big silos now and these silos are used, for IPM attacks.

    With the speed in uni-8, a player can do 14 IPM attacks in 3 minutes :whistling:

    Or 140 in 30 minutes. There is no limit to the attack count.

    I propose to introduce an IPM bashing rule.. max 10 IPM-attacks per 24 hours per target

    ccxx

    The post was edited 1 time, last by ccxx ().

  • Maybe a limit is not the best thing to deal with this, maybe we should lower the maximum number of missles in a silo just a little bit so it takes you a bit more time.

    I currently have 100.000.000.000.000.000.000 rocket launchers on all planets, it takes 200.000.000.000.000.000 IPM's to destroy them, this is about 8 attacks if your silo is level 50 (I believe, i don't know how much IPM's can fit in a level 50 silo but i thought is was: 25.000.000.000.000.000)

    Now, i would like to think that amount of rocket launchers is a normal amount of defence to have for all ranks, I would think the lower ranked players have about the same (I might be wrong) but then it should take quite some time to get a normal defence down.

    Keep in mind, when i was helping Corrado come up with a max amount of missiles in the silo i thought the ratio we have now would be perfect, apparently a lot of you think it isn't. So instead of a limit i propose we try to find the right amount of missiles you can store in a silo.

    Down here you can find my calculations, maybe someone can come up with a maximum amount of missiles to store in a silo. (i'd personally say dived the current amount by 5 (or 10) and see what happens) but go and have a whack at it your selves ;)

    Costs in metalIPM in metalNumber destroyed by 1 IPMDamage in metal by 1 IPMRatio 1 metal destroys x metal
    Missle Launcher2.000,0057.500,00500,001.000.000,0017,39130435
    Light Laser2.500,0057.500,00500,001.250.000,0021,73913043
    Heavy Laser10.000,0057.500,00125,001.250.000,0021,73913043
    Guass Canon58.000,0057.500,0028,571.657.060,0028,81843478
    Ion Cannon14.000,0057.500,00125,001.750.000,0030,43478261
    Plasma Cannon270.000,0057.500,0010,002.700.000,0046,95652174
    Gravitaion Cannon45.000.000,0057.500,000,031.350.000,0023,47826087
    Terro Drone485.000.000,0057.500,000,0048780492.365.853,6641,14528102




    EDIT:
    I want to state that it is very easy for a high ranking player to simply destroy the def and collect the resources with evo's than to attack with ifirits or other raiding fleet. if it would take the more time to destroy def with missles and thus making it faster/easyer to actually use fleet. Then the IPM's will mainly be used by the weaker players, like melkor suggest, to retaliate.

    An other thing i want to add is if there's a high ranked player (fleet 20 +) and he's destroying defence only to raid than he is a weakling, that is not how it's done and that is not how players should play this game :)

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Vinny ().

  • Vinny wrote:

    An other thing i want to add is if there's a high ranked player (fleet 20 +) and he's destroying defence only to raid than he is a weakling, that is not how it's done and that is not how players should play this game :)
    That's exactly what's happening, I have been hit by top 10 fleeters for my daily production... hardly worth the time really. So I can either suck it up and just be farmed whenever, or I can find the attackers planets closest to me, flatten him and get my res back. Next time the attacker will think twice about attacking.

    The same principle applies for fleeters, you will think twice about attacking someone if they attack you back.

    For me IMPs are only there for this reason, I don't use them otherwise, unless I find an inactive I want to farm.

  • Melkor wrote:

    That's exactly what's happening, I have been hit by top 10 fleeters for my daily production... hardly worth the time really. So I can either suck it up and just be farmed whenever, or I can find the attackers planets closest to me, flatten him and get my res back. Next time the attacker will think twice about attacking.

    The same principle applies for fleeters, you will think twice about attacking someone if they attack you back.

    For me IMPs are only there for this reason, I don't use them otherwise, unless I find an inactive I want to farm.
    thank you for pointing this out we wanted to revive a function back in game that was neglect at all why have silos and rockets when the ant used at all !

    and melkor's reply is the exact reason why this is a good part of the game -- players use them -- defenders attack back -- and others ar scared and never use it again ,and where the next player use it to provoke other player, when you ask me the perfect example how itshut go in a War(games)(Strategy)
    Grtz Corrado

  • The following fleets face each other: 23. May 2016, 21:40:27:


    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]








    Attacker


    Majrefal


    ([5:3:8]) (P)


    Weapons 7300% - Shields 7200% - Armour 7200%


    Column thriller : 75.000.000.000.000.000








    Defender


    Melkor


    ([5:1:8]) (P)


    Weapons 6700% - Shields 6600% - Armour 7000%


    Solar Satellite : 75.000.000


    Missle Launcher : 66.264.283.819.164.770.304


    Plasma Cannon : 28.166.207.267.487.232








    The attacking fleet fires with a power of 1.529.607.338.382.900.094.809.669.632 on the defender. The shields of the defender absorb 10.136.390.093.082.999.128.064 Damage points.


    The defending fleet fires with a power of 46.671.779.766.662.997.213.184 on the attacker. The shields of the attacker absorb 46.671.779.766.662.997.213.184 Damage points.








    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]








    Attacker


    Majrefal


    ([5:3:8]) (P)


    Weapons 7300% - Shields 7200% - Armour 7200%


    Column thriller : 75.000.000.000.000.000








    Defender


    Melkor


    ([5:1:8]) (P)


    Weapons 6700% - Shields 6600% - Armour 7000%


    Solar Satellite : 74.915.149


    Missle Launcher : 43.698.875.441.294.999.552


    Plasma Cannon : 27.119.211.458.187.000








    The attacking fleet fires with a power of 1.319.918.305.888.299.913.951.838.208 on the defender. The shields of the defender absorb 6.704.060.869.201.500.307.456 Damage points.


    The defending fleet fires with a power of 23.043.989.274.471.998.423.040 on the attacker. The shields of the attacker absorb 23.043.989.274.471.998.423.040 Damage points.








    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]








    Attacker


    Majrefal


    ([5:3:8]) (P)


    Weapons 7300% - Shields 7200% - Armour 7200%


    Column thriller : 75.000.000.000.000.000








    Defender


    Melkor


    ([5:1:8]) (P)


    Weapons 6700% - Shields 6600% - Armour 7000%


    Solar Satellite : 74.786.653


    Missle Launcher : 21.137.876.636.813.000.704


    Plasma Cannon : 13.118.015.978.716.000








    The attacking fleet fires with a power of 1.529.905.309.100.599.955.293.208.576 on the defender. The shields of the defender absorb 3.242.866.325.227.099.914.240 Damage points.


    The defending fleet fires with a power of 14.544.326.245.187.999.236.096 on the attacker. The shields of the attacker absorb 14.544.326.245.187.999.236.096 Damage points.








    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]








    Attacker


    Majrefal


    ([5:3:8]) (P)


    Weapons 7300% - Shields 7200% - Armour 7200%


    Column thriller : 75.000.000.000.000.000








    Defender


    Melkor


    ([5:1:8]) (P)


    Weapons 6700% - Shields 6600% - Armour 7000%


    Solar Satellite : 74.521.465








    The attacking fleet fires with a power of 5.677.200.000.000.000.398.458.880 on the defender. The shields of the defender absorb 566.363 Damage points.


    The defending fleet fires with a power of 677.102 on the attacker. The shields of the attacker absorb 677.102 Damage points.








    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]








    Attacker


    Majrefal


    ([5:3:8]) (P)


    Weapons 7300% - Shields 7200% - Armour 7200%


    Column thriller : 75.000.000.000.000.000








    Defender


    Melkor


    ([5:1:8]) (P)


    Weapons 6700% - Shields 6600% - Armour 7000%


    Destroyed








    [Blocked Image: http://www.corrado-game.org/images/stats/devider2.png]


    The attacker has won the battle


    He captures


    4.018.432.989.509.900.042.240


    Metal. 338.988.881.160.910.012.416


    Crystal 514.948.946.427.690.024.960


    Deuterium








    Attacker Losses:


    0


    units


    Defender Losses: 0


    units


    Debris: 5.067.068.398.250.800.185.344


    Metal and 30.982.828.069.235.998.720


    Crystal


    Moon Chance: 20


    %
    This is why people get nuked. this attacker ranked 14 in fleet!!! makes me wonder if he is too much a coward to go after player his own rank...

    The post was edited 2 times, last by Ev1l_EyE ().

  • Stop the crying Melkor.. your battle report is probably a revenge (in return) for your IPM attacks

    You leave large amounts of res on your planets. I attacked you 2x for it. I don't revenge IPM (as you noticed)

    When I find 60kT metal with a metal mine 122, that is 2 days res.

    You can't expect raiders to ignore you, only because you have no fleet.

  • Vinny wrote:

    Keep in mind, when i was helping Corrado come up with a max amount of missiles in the silo i thought the ratio we have now would be perfect, apparently a lot of you think it isn't. So instead of a limit i propose we try to find the right amount of missiles you can store in a silo.



    (….)


    An other thing i want to add is if there's a high ranked player (fleet 20 +) and he's destroying defence only to raid than he is a weakling, that is not how it's done and that is not how players should play this game :)
    Ah thanks for the data Vinny, very interesting !

    This was the attack of Melkor last week, look at the numbers.. I got 14 waves, but he needed 1 to eliminate my missile defense and only 5 to destroy my complete defense,

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Interplanetary rockets (62500000000000000) from [7:1:8] are on the planet [7:15:5]


    Missle Launcher (- 0)
    Light Laser Turret (- 0)
    Heavy Laser Turret (- 0)
    Guass Cannon (- 0)
    Ion Cannon (- 0)
    Plasma Cannon (- 0)
    Small Shield Dome (- 0)
    Large Shield Dome (- 0)
    Atmospheric Shield (- 0)
    Gravitons Cannon (- 0)
    Orbital Defence Platform (- 0)
    Terror Drone (- 1.4314396192742E+14)
    Interceptor (- 0)

    Interplanetary rockets (62500000000000000) from [7:1:8] are on the planet [7:15:5]


    Missle Launcher (- 0)
    Light Laser Turret (- 0)
    Heavy Laser Turret (- 0)
    Guass Cannon (- 0)
    Ion Cannon (- 0)
    Plasma Cannon (- 0)
    Small Shield Dome (- 0)
    Large Shield Dome (- 0)
    Atmospheric Shield (- 0)
    Gravitons Cannon (- 0)
    Orbital Defence Platform (- 0)
    Terror Drone (- 1.4314396192742E+14)
    Interceptor (- 0)

    Interplanetary rockets (62500000000000000) from [7:1:8] are on the planet [7:15:5]


    Missle Launcher (- 0)
    Light Laser Turret (- 0)
    Heavy Laser Turret (- 379612256021526300)
    Guass Cannon (- 37)
    Ion Cannon (- 0)
    Plasma Cannon (- 4067059761410556)
    Small Shield Dome (- 1)
    Large Shield Dome (- 1)
    Atmospheric Shield (- 1)
    Gravitons Cannon (- 491325984580986)
    Orbital Defence Platform (- 0)
    Terror Drone (- 54444529918922)
    Interceptor (- 0)

    Interplanetary rockets (62500000000000000) from [7:1:8] are on the planet [7:15:5]


    Missle Launcher (- 10459080910411260000)
    Light Laser Turret (- 0)
    Heavy Laser Turret (- 1.0532937967874E+18)
    Guass Cannon (- -37)
    Ion Cannon (- 0)
    Plasma Cannon (- 0)
    Small Shield Dome (- 0)
    Large Shield Dome (- 0)
    Atmospheric Shield (- 0)
    Gravitons Cannon (- 0)
    Orbital Defence Platform (- 0)
    Terror Drone (- 0)
    Interceptor (- 0)

    Interplanetary rockets (62500000000000000) from [7:1:8] are on the planet [7:15:5]


    17500000000000000 Rockets of your rockets were intercepted.Missle Launcher (- 1.0564024390244E+19)
    Light Laser Turret (- 0)
    Heavy Laser Turret (- 0)
    Guass Cannon (- 0)
    Ion Cannon (- 0)
    Plasma Cannon (- 0)
    Small Shield Dome (- 0)
    Large Shield Dome (- 0)
    Atmospheric Shield (- 0)
    Gravitons Cannon (- 0)
    Orbital Defence Platform (- 0)
    Terror Drone (- 0)
    Interceptor (- 0)

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    By the way.. when asteroids were set up, some changes were made. Did you count these too ? Prices were changed..

  • ccxx wrote:

    Stop the crying Melkor.. your battle report is probably a revenge (in return) for your IPM attacks

    You leave large amounts of res on your planets. I attacked you 2x for it. I don't revenge IPM (as you noticed)

    When I find 60kT metal with a metal mine 122, that is 2 days res.

    You can't expect raiders to ignore you, only because you have no fleet.
    Crying? No one is crying, just point out what happens.

    And as for your claim... I call bullshit, especially considering I have the game open on a daily bases and harvest all my res twice a day.

    And thanks for pointing out that I IPMed you, the fact that you haven't tried attacking again is proof that it's a deterrent. But it also makes me wonder who is crying now... oh dear 14 IPM attacks... boohoo

  • Melkor wrote:

    Melkor wrote:

    thanks for pointing out that I IPMed you, the fact that you haven't tried attacking again is proof that it's a deterrent. But it also makes me wonder who is crying now... oh dear 14 IPM attacks... boohoo

    I'd be happy to visit you again pal :P .. on the next spy.. let's say.. 36 kt Met and I fly ? would cover the deut cost

    Ok.. you are defense rank 8 now :saint: so I won't attack you too often, I promise..

  • damn right about uni 10 in regards to interplanetary missiles

    without a limit of missile attacks you just wait until someone is offline and bash his defense into the ground until nothing is left of it

    for example in around 10 minutes 42 missile attacks on 1 planet just to farm a few resources, attacks were done by atm #4 in statistics, Corado (which in my opinion should be checked out by corrado because i think it should be forbidden to make an account with nearly the same name as the game admin ^^)

    if this keeps going on we can close down universe 10 in a few months because either all people will go inactive or into v-mode, there's no reason atm to build a good defense so you can store up some resources if all someone needs to do is bash you with interplanetary missiles

  • DiEnd wrote:

    damn right about uni 10 in regards to interplanetary missiles

    without a limit of missile attacks you just wait until someone is offline and bash his defense into the ground until nothing is left of it

    for example in around 10 minutes 42 missile attacks on 1 planet just to farm a few resources, attacks were done by atm #4 in statistics, Corado (which in my opinion should be checked out by corrado because i think it should be forbidden to make an account with nearly the same name as the game admin ^^)

    if this keeps going on we can close down universe 10 in a few months because either all people will go inactive or into v-mode, there's no reason atm to build a good defense so you can store up some resources if all someone needs to do is bash you with interplanetary missiles
    Missile launchers are too easy to build and hard to destroy. If you decide to do that then you should also increase defenses destroyed debris because there is no point launching a massive ship attack that requires more fuel (deuterium) than you earn profit

  • :sleeping:

    this again...

    Read further up, if you are going to limit IPMs then the number of fleet hits should be reduces as well, a top fleeter could easily crush defense without any losses, is a miner just supposed to do nothing?

    Another alternative to the limit in IPMs; limit them yes, but then make them more powerful. Dont see how it's fair that a top fleeter can bash you 6 times, get your res, harvest the df from the defenses but then only be limited to 14 IPMs as retaliation.

    Again, this is just dumb, fleeters need to grow a pair, if you attack someone then you do it knowing there will be retaliation. get over it

  • Indeed that is what IPM should do, revenge and war. But in this case, mister buildings rank #4, fleet #260 (looks like a noob miner) is visiting me daily with IPM and cargo afterward. He can use IPM for profit. I had 14 hours res on my planets.

    Read further up, if you are going to limit IPMs then the number of fleet hits should be reduces as well, a top fleeter could easily crush defense without any losses, is a miner just supposed to do nothing?
    You see only the revenge. IPM's are profitable in uni-10, revenge is not the issue.. I never attacked him because he is on 24/24 online spying me :P

    A top fleet cannot "easily" crush big defense. Flying big fleet is a risk and expensive.

    Another alternative to the limit in IPMs; limit them yes, but then make them more powerful. Dont see how it's fair that a top fleeter can bash you 6 times, get your res, harvest the df from the defenses but then only be limited to 14 IPMs as retaliation.
    More powerful ? 8) When BOOM wiped 8 of my planets with IPM yesterday I went defense rank 18 to 24. I've now silo 61 everywhere, filled up with ABM's to at least prevent this quick trick.. and make it less profitable. It cost me a day res.

    Again, this is just dumb, fleeters need to grow a pair, if you attack someone then you do it knowing there will be retaliation. get over it
    Again Melkor IPM in uni-8 and uni-10 is not about revenge, it's just a small inbalance. It is profitable to attack big miners with defs you advocate. I am not a real fleeter, I'm a miner with some fleet. I am now fleet #8. I cannot bash top #10 defense in uni-10 and some players who are defense #30 I cannot bash on 1 or 2 planets. There's a balance.

    Why is IPM unbalanced ? because there is no limit.. you can handle anything on a planet if you have the time for it.. and IPMs cost only 57k and 68750000000000000 of them cost only 4kT (3.953125E21). Average metal mine yield per hour (excluding officers) is 0,8kT with metal 122. So counting ONLY the metal, an IPM attack 3x will be profitable every 12 hours. Now. Metal 122 is not extreme, this uni is 2 weeks old. IPM's will keep their price, raid goes up.

    You don't want a max per player ? ok.. other solutions are..

    - increasing the price of IPM
    - limiting the total IPM attacks per day
    - silo can contain only half when IPMs are built
    - decrease IPM attack strength
    - get rid of ABM, IPM and silos
    - ASTEROIDS :D

    The post was edited 4 times, last by ccxx ().

  • ccxx wrote:

    Indeed that is what IPM should do, revenge and war. But in this case, mister buildings rank #4, fleet #260 (looks like a noob miner) is visiting me daily with IPM and cargo afterward. He can use IPM for profit. I had 14 hours res on my planets.

    Read further up, if you are going to limit IPMs then the number of fleet hits should be reduces as well, a top fleeter could easily crush defense without any losses, is a miner just supposed to do nothing?
    You see only the revenge. IPM's are profitable in uni-10, revenge is not the issue.. I never attacked him because he is on 24/24 online spying me :P
    A top fleet cannot "easily" crush big defense. Flying big fleet is a risk and expensive.

    Another alternative to the limit in IPMs; limit them yes, but then make them more powerful. Dont see how it's fair that a top fleeter can bash you 6 times, get your res, harvest the df from the defenses but then only be limited to 14 IPMs as retaliation.
    More powerful ? 8) When BOOM wiped 8 of my planets with IPM yesterday I went defense rank 18 to 24. I've now silo 61 everywhere, filled up with ABM's to at least prevent this quick trick.. and make it less profitable. It cost me a day res.
    Again, this is just dumb, fleeters need to grow a pair, if you attack someone then you do it knowing there will be retaliation. get over it
    Again Melkor IPM in uni-8 and uni-10 is not about revenge, it's just a small inbalance. It is profitable to attack big miners with defs you advocate. I am not a real fleeter, I'm a miner with some fleet. I am now fleet #8. I cannot bash top #10 defense in uni-10 and some players who are defense #30 I cannot bash on 1 or 2 planets. There's a balance.
    Why is IPM unbalanced ? because there is no limit.. you can handle anything on a planet if you have the time for it.. and IPMs cost only 57k and 68750000000000000 of them cost only 4kT (3.953125E21). Average metal mine yield per hour (excluding officers) is 0,8kT with metal 122. So counting ONLY the metal, an IPM attack 3x will be profitable every 12 hours. Now. Metal 122 is not extreme, this uni is 2 weeks old. IPM's will keep their price, raid goes up.

    You don't want a max per player ? ok.. other solutions are..

    - increasing the price of IPM
    - limiting the total IPM attacks per day
    - silo can contain only half when IPMs are built
    - decrease IPM attack strength
    - get rid of ABM, IPM and silos
    - ASTEROIDS :D
    Ok, do away with them, limit them, do whatever, but if you do you'd have to balance it, if a miner is not allowed to retaliate then a fleeter is not allowed to profit from bashing your defenses.

    No ABM, IPM and silos will just be fine if 0% defense goes into DF